New MakeMKV user here. Made only about 4 backups so far. Starting with John Wick 1-4.
I have watched some Youtube videos from Techenthusiasm dated within the last year. Trying to decide best method to Rip my 4K Blurays to MakeMKV down to bare essentials.
Needs:
Dolby 5.1 for soundbars etc, and Dolbuy Atmos tracks
English subtitles: for my wifes mom who cant hear well, AND Forced subtitles for Alien speak and automatic (forced) foreign language speaking that is suppose to be in the movies to understand context.
Let me know if this method is best
To be the most efficient should i :
1) Do a MakeMKV Backup from Disk......or just do a regular MakeMKV (1st time) from Disk and select the main (largest file size) 0800 Title track
2) Open Backup file and then Remux the files again to ....to remove extra languages/playlists i dont need, Or should i just Remux the Regular Make MKV file? Any difference between the two methods?
3) Keep Dolby 5.1 and 7.1 tracks , DTS if applicable
4) Keep movie Title with file name 0800 as this is usually the English one if there is multiple of similar Large GB size. Unselect the rest of the smaller Titles as these would not be the full movie.
5)Now comes Forced Tracks - im confused here. I read to do the following: 1) Rename each forced track "FORCED" and then set MakeMKV Flag as "DF".
5a) Figure out what subtitle tracks are Descriptive subtitle tracks (the ones that explain what sounds you are suppose to be hearing..."the clock bell rings" (which dont want) vs which ones are regular languages subtitle tracks you can optionally turn on during the movie. See 5c
5b)MakeMKV(again #2)) the file with the new Subtitles and Forced Subtitles (which there could be 1, 2 or 3 sets of tracks that seem like what you need.
5c) Subtitle track - Download "Subtitle Edit" software, and open the MakeMKV file with it to see which Audio tracks i extracted is the Regular, and which is the Descriptive Audio Track. Delete the Descriptive one.
6) Open MakeMKV file in Make MKV again. Uncheck the Track that was the Descriptive audio track
MakeMKV (again (#3)
I was told there could be more than 2 tracks (subtitles and Forced subtitles) What further do i need to do to find the correct ones to keep?
I dont want to accidently remove any Alien or Foreign language Forced subtitles needed to watch a movie appropriately.
Anything else im missing?
Most effcient method to Rip new Makemkv files with subtitle and forced subtitles
Re: Most effcient method to Rip new Makemkv files with subtitle and forced subtitles
PS. Is there a live Google Doc that someone has posted that lists each movie and what Subtitle tracks have the correct Forced Subtitles to choose?
Seems like a group document would be ideal!
Seems like a group document would be ideal!
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Radiocomms237
- Posts: 373
- Joined: Mon Oct 18, 2021 12:23 am
Re: Most effcient method to Rip new Makemkv files with subtitle and forced subtitles
To begin with, I always play a disc in my home player first (I have an LG UBK80 setup next to my PC with a wall-mounted TV). I make a note of the runtime and chapter count of all the titles I want to rip off the disc (and if there are multiple titles with the same runtimes (like episodes of a TV Series), I will also note the first line of dialogue or describe the first scene so I can more easily ID the file later).
Next I make a full decrypted backup of the disc. This is extremely helpful because you can play files in VLC Media Player directly from the backup folders, which (sometimes) saves you having to pre-rip just to check subtitle tracks etc.
Then open the backup in MakeMKV and cross-check the runtimes from your notes with those in the list of files (you can't always rely on the file size being the biggest, and 00800 files are typically only used by a small number of disc mastering companies (all be them large companies), others have their own numbering schemes, and still others seem to have no numbering scheme whatsoever) and add the title labels as you match the runtimes.
Similarly, different companies organize their tracks in different ways. Some have an English "Dialogue only" track immediately followed by a "Closed Caption" track, some have them the other way around, and some have the dialogue track at the top of the list and the captions track at the bottom (or even somewhere in the middle)!
And some companies mark lines as "Forced" within the main subtitle track (which MakeMKV converts into those "forced only" tracks you see), and some have a completely separate track for those particular lines.
Some will mark lines as forced within only the dialogue track (and not the captions track), some the other way around, and some will mark lines as forced within both (in this case the forced lines from a captions track usually have the caption elements as well. For example, a forced line from a dialogue track may just translate "Una cerveza por favor" as "One beer please" while the same forced line from a captions track may say "[Speaking Spainsh:] One beer please")
If you only want English tracks, that makes life a lot easier as you'll likely have only two or three from which to choose.
If you play the first transport stream (.m2ts file) from the segment map of your movie directly from the BDMV/STREAM folder of your backup, you can usually pick which English track has captions as most movies seem to start with sound effects rather than dialogue (for example [♪♪♪] or [Wind howling] etc.).
Sorry this is getting a bit long-winded, but before I go I should mention that as well as setting the MKV flags to "df" (default + forced), you probably should "Order-weight" that track to the top of the list as well. Some players will act on the "Default" flag alone. some on the "Forced" flag, and others need the default track to be the first one in the list.
I'm sure I've probably missed about a thousand other important points, but I'll let somebody else do some typing for a change!
Next I make a full decrypted backup of the disc. This is extremely helpful because you can play files in VLC Media Player directly from the backup folders, which (sometimes) saves you having to pre-rip just to check subtitle tracks etc.
Then open the backup in MakeMKV and cross-check the runtimes from your notes with those in the list of files (you can't always rely on the file size being the biggest, and 00800 files are typically only used by a small number of disc mastering companies (all be them large companies), others have their own numbering schemes, and still others seem to have no numbering scheme whatsoever) and add the title labels as you match the runtimes.
Similarly, different companies organize their tracks in different ways. Some have an English "Dialogue only" track immediately followed by a "Closed Caption" track, some have them the other way around, and some have the dialogue track at the top of the list and the captions track at the bottom (or even somewhere in the middle)!
And some companies mark lines as "Forced" within the main subtitle track (which MakeMKV converts into those "forced only" tracks you see), and some have a completely separate track for those particular lines.
Some will mark lines as forced within only the dialogue track (and not the captions track), some the other way around, and some will mark lines as forced within both (in this case the forced lines from a captions track usually have the caption elements as well. For example, a forced line from a dialogue track may just translate "Una cerveza por favor" as "One beer please" while the same forced line from a captions track may say "[Speaking Spainsh:] One beer please")
If you only want English tracks, that makes life a lot easier as you'll likely have only two or three from which to choose.
If you play the first transport stream (.m2ts file) from the segment map of your movie directly from the BDMV/STREAM folder of your backup, you can usually pick which English track has captions as most movies seem to start with sound effects rather than dialogue (for example [♪♪♪] or [Wind howling] etc.).
Sorry this is getting a bit long-winded, but before I go I should mention that as well as setting the MKV flags to "df" (default + forced), you probably should "Order-weight" that track to the top of the list as well. Some players will act on the "Default" flag alone. some on the "Forced" flag, and others need the default track to be the first one in the list.
I'm sure I've probably missed about a thousand other important points, but I'll let somebody else do some typing for a change!
Re: Most effcient method to Rip new Makemkv files with subtitle and forced subtitles
The benefits of making a decrypted backup of a disc are that it gives you access to the transport streams Radiocomms237 mentioned. This lets you look at a title before you turn it into a .mkv file. If you want to rip all the blu-ray extras often included, this is essential.
The decrypted backup also allows you to make .mkv files at the speed of your storage. This lets you create a .mkv file a second or third time in a relatively short amount of time. Since the layout of discs is all over the place, I sometimes find a need to take a second pass at something.
I don't put my discs into a TV-connected player to make notes about chapters and runtimes like Radiocomms237 does. That strategy is perfectly reasonable, but I choose to figure things out watching bits of transports streams when necessary. This is probably why I occasionally have to remake a .mkv file.
Also, I don't mess with the order weight of tracks in MakeMKV. I generally transcode my blu-ray rips before they go on my Plex, so I do any necessary track re-ordering at that stage. If a movie has a forced subtitle track, I make sure it is the first subtitle track in my transcoded file. Philosophically speaking, I understand the desire for the .mkv rip to be completely 'perfect' with all tracks labeled correctly and in the proper order; I just find that pursuit exhausting. I've settled on a balance I can achieve that let's me get things onto my Plex so I can enjoy watching them as much as I enjoy curating the files.
I do mark forced tracks as default and forced in the .mkv rip. I try to get it right in MakeMKV (again via transport stream viewing), but if necessary I fix up those flags afterwards using mkvpropedit.
Generally I keep all audio tracks and subtitle tracks in my language of choice except for 'descriptive audio' tracks. Fortunately I'm not blind so these tracks are of little value to me. I try to get all the audio and subtitle tracks named correctly. The most common 'extra' audio track is a commentary track.
The decrypted backup also allows you to make .mkv files at the speed of your storage. This lets you create a .mkv file a second or third time in a relatively short amount of time. Since the layout of discs is all over the place, I sometimes find a need to take a second pass at something.
I don't put my discs into a TV-connected player to make notes about chapters and runtimes like Radiocomms237 does. That strategy is perfectly reasonable, but I choose to figure things out watching bits of transports streams when necessary. This is probably why I occasionally have to remake a .mkv file.
Also, I don't mess with the order weight of tracks in MakeMKV. I generally transcode my blu-ray rips before they go on my Plex, so I do any necessary track re-ordering at that stage. If a movie has a forced subtitle track, I make sure it is the first subtitle track in my transcoded file. Philosophically speaking, I understand the desire for the .mkv rip to be completely 'perfect' with all tracks labeled correctly and in the proper order; I just find that pursuit exhausting. I've settled on a balance I can achieve that let's me get things onto my Plex so I can enjoy watching them as much as I enjoy curating the files.
I do mark forced tracks as default and forced in the .mkv rip. I try to get it right in MakeMKV (again via transport stream viewing), but if necessary I fix up those flags afterwards using mkvpropedit.
Generally I keep all audio tracks and subtitle tracks in my language of choice except for 'descriptive audio' tracks. Fortunately I'm not blind so these tracks are of little value to me. I try to get all the audio and subtitle tracks named correctly. The most common 'extra' audio track is a commentary track.
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Radiocomms237
- Posts: 373
- Joined: Mon Oct 18, 2021 12:23 am
Re: Most effcient method to Rip new Makemkv files with subtitle and forced subtitles
Yeah, I have to plead guilty to that charge (your honor).
And yes, it is exhausting with some discs. I have, on occasion, spent an entire day working on ripping just one disc that was a really complicated structure. It's times like this that you're REALLY glad you made and are working from a backup copy!
That's part of the reason I text-map my discs first in a regular player, too. I just found it exhausting ripping every file and playing the guessing game later, watching them all trying to identify each one. And half the time I'd end up going back to play the disc again anyway because some extras don't have title cards on them so I had no idea what to name them.
Everybody seems to think it's a waste of time mapping the disc contents first, but I honestly think I wasted more time trying to figure out what everything was after the fact. Now, with the exception of the odd "Easter egg", I know what each and every file I rip is before I rip it.
Plus, I know of no other way to get the chapter names, not only for the main feature, but for deleted scenes etc. as well.
In the end, just do what's best for you, we're just giving you options!
Re: Most effcient method to Rip new Makemkv files with subtitle and forced subtitles
@Radiocomms237 @Decoke22. Thanks for the additional context. This does seem like a journey of sorts to get a rip that is ready to play on my server with the correct forced tracks.
I will add doing a disk Backup as my first run now, then i can just put the disk away. Then take another pass at any additional tracks in need to keep/remove.
ill check out mkvpropedit as well!
I will add doing a disk Backup as my first run now, then i can just put the disk away. Then take another pass at any additional tracks in need to keep/remove.
ill check out mkvpropedit as well!
Re: Most effcient method to Rip new Makemkv files with subtitle and forced subtitles
I find disc reviews on blu-ray.com are a good way to expedite figuring out the 'extras' on a disc. Most of their reviews have runtimes for the extras, so I can sort out which extra is which from the runtimes listed in the review.
Re: Most effcient method to Rip new Makemkv files with subtitle and forced subtitles
Here is another source for movies with forced subs:
https://www.avsforum.com/threads/movies ... s.1176923/
https://www.avsforum.com/threads/movies ... s.1176923/