Dolby Vision now possible through MP4 Mux.

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szymon
Posts: 5
Joined: Sun May 05, 2019 11:19 am

Re: Dolby Vision now possible through MP4 Mux.

Post by szymon » Sat May 18, 2019 11:32 am

Ray80 wrote:
Tue May 07, 2019 11:52 am
Hi. When I add a second audio with mp4muxer, my LG C7 shows both tracks, but only plays the first audio (even when I select the second track in the LG internal player). Have you done any aditional task to play both tracks in the LG TV?
Hi, I had no issues. Maybe LG C8 has better player or yours source material/audio was wrong. If you can cut few seconds of this video and upload somewhere I can test it. But I am not sure if muxer can cut video like mkvtoolnix.

bgalakazam
Posts: 14
Joined: Wed May 01, 2019 6:15 pm
Location: Italy

Re: Dolby Vision now possible through MP4 Mux.

Post by bgalakazam » Sat May 18, 2019 9:10 pm

Grencola wrote:
Wed May 15, 2019 4:30 pm
enabling the dv option it has just essentially forces fake dv from the base hdr10 layer without seeing the actual dv Metadata. the tv might say dv, but check the player info - it will only be hdr10. I thought the same thing at first too. (see pg. 9)
Even on the mp4 lossy audio files? Also, which are the clones out there right now if it can be discussed.

Grencola
Posts: 137
Joined: Sun Jan 27, 2019 5:19 pm

Re: Dolby Vision now possible through MP4 Mux.

Post by Grencola » Sat May 18, 2019 10:01 pm

bgalakazam wrote:
Sat May 18, 2019 9:10 pm
Grencola wrote:
Wed May 15, 2019 4:30 pm
enabling the dv option it has just essentially forces fake dv from the base hdr10 layer without seeing the actual dv Metadata. the tv might say dv, but check the player info - it will only be hdr10. I thought the same thing at first too. (see pg. 9)
Even on the mp4 lossy audio files? Also, which are the clones out there right now if it can be discussed.
MP4's work properly on the x700 via both USB and dlna (plex server etc). that's the only thing that plays in DV, other than discs obviously.

bd-rom dot com is the oppo clone. not sure we can discuss it here though, use this forum instead: https://www.avforums.com/threads/the-ul ... e.2207229/

tango306
Posts: 27
Joined: Wed May 22, 2019 12:29 am

Re: Dolby Vision now possible through MP4 Mux.

Post by tango306 » Wed May 22, 2019 12:35 am

Hi folks.

I was reading a discussion on Reddit where a member comments that on his Oppo 203 when playing one of these MP4 DV remuxes it reports the video stream as 10-bit, however if he plays the same movie from a full disc copy (including BDMV folder) that it reports the video stream as 12-bit.
https://www.reddit.com/r/Piracy/comment ... dium=web2x

The suggestion being that, although these remuxes are in a DV format, they are not actually sending the DV's proper 12-bit metadata.

Can anyone comment on this? How do we know we are actually getting DV as opposed to a standard HDR which is packaged as DV but not actually sending the proper 12-bit metadata?

Grencola
Posts: 137
Joined: Sun Jan 27, 2019 5:19 pm

Re: Dolby Vision now possible through MP4 Mux.

Post by Grencola » Wed May 22, 2019 2:41 am

tango306 wrote:
Wed May 22, 2019 12:35 am
Hi folks.

I was reading a discussion on Reddit where a member comments that on his Oppo 203 when playing one of these MP4 DV remuxes it reports the video stream as 10-bit, however if he plays the same movie from a full disc copy (including BDMV folder) that it reports the video stream as 12-bit.
https://www.reddit.com/r/Piracy/comment ... dium=web2x

The suggestion being that, although these remuxes are in a DV format, they are not actually sending the DV's proper 12-bit metadata.

Can anyone comment on this? How do we know we are actually getting DV as opposed to a standard HDR which is packaged as DV but not actually sending the proper 12-bit metadata?
there are no 12-bit panels on the market so don't worry about that. and yes obviously dv still makes a huge difference.

tango306
Posts: 27
Joined: Wed May 22, 2019 12:29 am

Re: Dolby Vision now possible through MP4 Mux.

Post by tango306 » Wed May 22, 2019 3:44 am

Grencola wrote:
tango306 wrote:
Wed May 22, 2019 12:35 am
Hi folks.

I was reading a discussion on Reddit where a member comments that on his Oppo 203 when playing one of these MP4 DV remuxes it reports the video stream as 10-bit, however if he plays the same movie from a full disc copy (including BDMV folder) that it reports the video stream as 12-bit.
https://www.reddit.com/r/Piracy/comment ... dium=web2x

The suggestion being that, although these remuxes are in a DV format, they are not actually sending the DV's proper 12-bit metadata.

Can anyone comment on this? How do we know we are actually getting DV as opposed to a standard HDR which is packaged as DV but not actually sending the proper 12-bit metadata?
there are no 12-bit panels on the market so don't worry about that. and yes obviously dv still makes a huge difference.
You are missing the point and do not understand the benefit of DV.
12-bit source and signal shows improvement on 10-bit panel. Period. This has been proven many times if you search.

Now, back to my original question, is DV muxed into MP4 container, degrades in any way or form when played back on DV capable display such as LG OLEDs and/or Oppo-203?

sm0ke83
Posts: 14
Joined: Wed May 22, 2019 12:28 pm

Re: Dolby Vision now possible through MP4 Mux.

Post by sm0ke83 » Wed May 22, 2019 12:53 pm

Hi Grencola, a lot of progress with your tool i see (posted a few times on other forum, mrmc, same topic).
I've converted about 20 movies i guess with mp4muxer, DV is definitely a big improvement over HDR.
Don't understand why i can't get it to work with mkv's, only m2ts works for me. Tried about 6 times with different movies (always use cmd btw.).
Progress finishes same as with m2ts, but not playable, continuous stutter.
Read this topic; not many people have this issue, am i right? Tried opening MKV with MKVToolNix, but no errors or option to "correct" the file (saw your post about this might solve things).
I always use scene/p2p-rleases from torrents (I own dvd's and blu-rays...)
Any idea what might be the problem here?
Thnx.

Grencola
Posts: 137
Joined: Sun Jan 27, 2019 5:19 pm

Re: Dolby Vision now possible through MP4 Mux.

Post by Grencola » Thu May 23, 2019 3:22 am

tango306 wrote:
Wed May 22, 2019 3:44 am
You are missing the point and do not understand the benefit of DV.
12-bit source and signal shows improvement on 10-bit panel. Period. This has been proven many times if you search.

Now, back to my original question, is DV muxed into MP4 container, degrades in any way or form when played back on DV capable display such as LG OLEDs and/or Oppo-203?
oh no, I get it. Dolby claims 12-bit dv can be down-sampled in such a way as to render 10-bit color more accurately, yada yada. I just honestly can't tell the difference, nor can a whole forum of people with better eyes than mine. versus hdr10 however, absolutely there's a massive change.
Also I've done so many back to back tests between these mp4's and playing the actual 12-bit discs and I don't see any difference, minus the odd artifact here or there. but I also don't have an oled with an Oppo udp-203 so I suppose I could be slightly missing out.

Grencola
Posts: 137
Joined: Sun Jan 27, 2019 5:19 pm

Re: Dolby Vision now possible through MP4 Mux.

Post by Grencola » Thu May 23, 2019 3:28 am

sm0ke83 wrote:
Wed May 22, 2019 12:53 pm
Hi Grencola, a lot of progress with your tool i see (posted a few times on other forum, mrmc, same topic).
I've converted about 20 movies i guess with mp4muxer, DV is definitely a big improvement over HDR.
Don't understand why i can't get it to work with mkv's, only m2ts works for me. Tried about 6 times with different movies (always use cmd btw.).
Progress finishes same as with m2ts, but not playable, continuous stutter.
Read this topic; not many people have this issue, am i right? Tried opening MKV with MKVToolNix, but no errors or option to "correct" the file (saw your post about this might solve things).
I always use scene/p2p-rleases from torrents (I own dvd's and blu-rays...)
Any idea what might be the problem here?
Thnx.
yea it's come a long way ;) have you tried using it at all instead of your own tsmuxer demuxing / cmd prompt commands? it uses eac3to which pretty much never errors and I've made over 30 mp4s from mkv remuxes that work just as well as m2ts files. I also found that Western Digital hdd's plays them waay better than Seagate for some reason, using the exact same file on both drives. also if they're in a sub-folder instead of the root of the drive they stutter and error and play terribly.

sm0ke83
Posts: 14
Joined: Wed May 22, 2019 12:28 pm

Re: Dolby Vision now possible through MP4 Mux.

Post by sm0ke83 » Thu May 23, 2019 6:48 am

Grencola wrote:
Thu May 23, 2019 3:28 am
sm0ke83 wrote:
Wed May 22, 2019 12:53 pm
Hi Grencola, a lot of progress with your tool i see (posted a few times on other forum, mrmc, same topic).
I've converted about 20 movies i guess with mp4muxer, DV is definitely a big improvement over HDR.
Don't understand why i can't get it to work with mkv's, only m2ts works for me. Tried about 6 times with different movies (always use cmd btw.).
Progress finishes same as with m2ts, but not playable, continuous stutter.
Read this topic; not many people have this issue, am i right? Tried opening MKV with MKVToolNix, but no errors or option to "correct" the file (saw your post about this might solve things).
I always use scene/p2p-rleases from torrents (I own dvd's and blu-rays...)
Any idea what might be the problem here?
Thnx.
yea it's come a long way ;) have you tried using it at all instead of your own tsmuxer demuxing / cmd prompt commands? it uses eac3to which pretty much never errors and I've made over 30 mp4s from mkv remuxes that work just as well as m2ts files. I also found that Western Digital hdd's plays them waay better than Seagate for some reason, using the exact same file on both drives. also if they're in a sub-folder instead of the root of the drive they stutter and error and play terribly.
I use eac3to from your program/archive and same command as u use in the two cmd files. Because I prefer 2 physical disks, I put in the commands manually. Don’t see why root/folder/mapped network drive would make a difference in creating the mp4, but will try with your program on local drive only to be sure.
I stream from NAS to LG tv with dlna. Root folder, u mean when playing or when creating mp4 file? No stutter with m2ts though which also uses eac3to. Last movie I tried is “The Witch”, HEVC-Blu-ray is fine, remux fails/stutters.

Greets

tango306
Posts: 27
Joined: Wed May 22, 2019 12:29 am

Re: Dolby Vision now possible through MP4 Mux.

Post by tango306 » Thu May 23, 2019 11:47 am

Grencola wrote:
Thu May 23, 2019 3:22 am
tango306 wrote:
Wed May 22, 2019 3:44 am
You are missing the point and do not understand the benefit of DV.
12-bit source and signal shows improvement on 10-bit panel. Period. This has been proven many times if you search.

Now, back to my original question, is DV muxed into MP4 container, degrades in any way or form when played back on DV capable display such as LG OLEDs and/or Oppo-203?
oh no, I get it. Dolby claims 12-bit dv can be down-sampled in such a way as to render 10-bit color more accurately, yada yada. I just honestly can't tell the difference, nor can a whole forum of people with better eyes than mine. versus hdr10 however, absolutely there's a massive change.
Also I've done so many back to back tests between these mp4's and playing the actual 12-bit discs and I don't see any difference, minus the odd artifact here or there. but I also don't have an oled with an Oppo udp-203 so I suppose I could be slightly missing out.
12-bit contents looks better than 10-bit contents even on 10-bit panel just like 4K contents looks better than 1080p contents even on 1080p panel.
(And SACD (DSD) and DVD-A (MLP) sound better than redbook CD even on loudspeakers whose frequency response range is no where near high/low enough to cover those high resolution audio sources).

That being said, if this muxed DV MP4 is degraded from DV's native 12-bit to 10-bit, we are not seeing a true DV.
And if somehow 12-bit is degraded into 10-bit in muxing process, who know what else is borked in the chain.

Grencola
Posts: 137
Joined: Sun Jan 27, 2019 5:19 pm

Re: Dolby Vision now possible through MP4 Mux.

Post by Grencola » Thu May 23, 2019 2:17 pm

tango306 wrote:
Thu May 23, 2019 11:47 am
12-bit contents looks better than 10-bit contents even on 10-bit panel just like 4K contents looks better than 1080p contents even on 1080p panel.

That being said, if this muxed DV MP4 is degraded from DV's native 12-bit to 10-bit, we are not seeing a true DV.
And if somehow 12-bit is degraded into 10-bit in muxing process, who know what else is borked in the chain.
opinions are like butt holes, we all have one :)
https://www.quora.com/Does-a-4K-Blu-Ray ... -Ray-movie
anyway, if you really think these mp4s are so borked simply don't use them. go spend thousands on an Oppo / discs / whatever and enjoy seeing the display info show 12-bit on your 10-bit panel. you're clearly not the target demographic for these files, as they're for those of us who don't have the most expensive setups and like saving lots of money on something your eyes can barely, if at all, perceive.

tango306
Posts: 27
Joined: Wed May 22, 2019 12:29 am

Re: Dolby Vision now possible through MP4 Mux.

Post by tango306 » Fri May 24, 2019 1:06 am

Grencola wrote:
Thu May 23, 2019 2:17 pm
tango306 wrote:
Thu May 23, 2019 11:47 am
12-bit contents looks better than 10-bit contents even on 10-bit panel just like 4K contents looks better than 1080p contents even on 1080p panel.

That being said, if this muxed DV MP4 is degraded from DV's native 12-bit to 10-bit, we are not seeing a true DV.
And if somehow 12-bit is degraded into 10-bit in muxing process, who know what else is borked in the chain.
opinions are like butt holes, we all have one :)
https://www.quora.com/Does-a-4K-Blu-Ray ... -Ray-movie
anyway, if you really think these mp4s are so borked simply don't use them. go spend thousands on an Oppo / discs / whatever and enjoy seeing the display info show 12-bit on your 10-bit panel. you're clearly not the target demographic for these files, as they're for those of us who don't have the most expensive setups and like saving lots of money on something your eyes can barely, if at all, perceive.
Now, I think you are not only missing the point but also not reading before replying. Spending thousands on Oppo-203 and diskcs are completely irrelevant here. Lol.
I do not think DV muxed MP4 are borked. (There is a *if*)
Most of (if not all) Dolby Vision contents are mastered at native 12-bit. This is locked down at mastering/authoring stage. My question was if Oppo-203 reporting the MP4 being played is in 10-bit was true or not? Whether anyone has done any verification on it? It might still be in 12-bit MP4, but due to Oppo's firmware bug reporting it as 10-bit for MP4 file playback. Who knows?
Grencola wrote:
Thu May 23, 2019 3:22 am
Also I've done so many back to back tests between these mp4's and playing the actual 12-bit discs and I don't see any difference, minus the odd artifact here or there. but I also don't have an oled with an Oppo udp-203 so I suppose I could be slightly missing out.
Just because you can't see it doesn't mean it's not there. What display did you use?

deadchip12
Posts: 11
Joined: Thu May 02, 2019 2:49 am

Re: Dolby Vision now possible through MP4 Mux.

Post by deadchip12 » Fri May 24, 2019 1:43 am

Hi Grencola, I’m using your program to make dolby vision mp4 file. The first few movies were flawless, but with the recent one Mission Impossible: Rogue Nation, the program initially detected dolby vision layer but after some time running it displayed a bunch of red texts saying there is no dolby vision track and file’s damaged or sth. Any idea? The movie still plays fine in hdr10, and I can still see the dv layer in tsmuxerGUI

Grencola
Posts: 137
Joined: Sun Jan 27, 2019 5:19 pm

Re: Dolby Vision now possible through MP4 Mux.

Post by Grencola » Fri May 24, 2019 3:46 am

tango306 wrote:
Fri May 24, 2019 1:06 am
Now, I think you are not only missing the point but also not reading before replying. Spending thousands on Oppo-203 and diskcs are completely irrelevant here. Lol.
I do not think DV muxed MP4 are borked. (There is a *if*)
Most of (if not all) Dolby Vision contents are mastered at native 12-bit. This is locked down at mastering/authoring stage. My question was if Oppo-203 reporting the MP4 being played is in 10-bit was true or not? Whether anyone has done any verification on it? It might still be in 12-bit MP4, but due to Oppo's firmware bug reporting it as 10-bit for MP4 file playback. Who knows?
Grencola wrote:
Thu May 23, 2019 3:22 am
Also I've done so many back to back tests between these mp4's and playing the actual 12-bit discs and I don't see any difference, minus the odd artifact here or there. but I also don't have an oled with an Oppo udp-203 so I suppose I could be slightly missing out.
Just because you can't see it doesn't mean it's not there. What display did you use?
I was sticking up for the mp4s a bit cuz you said, "And if somehow 12-bit is degraded into 10-bit in muxing process, who know what else is borked in the chain." but nothing seems to be degraded in the chain was all.
perhaps I got a bit defensive, and misinterpreted your words, sorry :p I can't verify it myself as I don't own an Oppo, but I have read on avsforum of people saying the same thing with 12-bit content showing up as 10-bit, while others replying not to worry as there's no difference, citing links to various tests etc. (basically where I got my influences from heh). Anyway regardless of all that, I've only tried with Vizio's p65 and m65 (usb) and LG's C8 (plex) displays so I'm definitely not the best person to be determining what's really going on. I'll try and find the forum link so you can talk to people with more experience.

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